I’m going. Seriously. If I ever visit America and that’s open, I’m there. HONESTLY. I’ll be too busy laughing or crying to take any of it in, but I’m still going.
Also 984, even if it does go back to the first person or prophet, that would only take in the “Human” era of existance. It’d be about what, 10000 years?
I half agree with Sin, and half with the 984. I don’t like this at all, but at least I can be thankful there are someplaces that haven’t been invaded by fundementalists so far.
Although, as a not, the 984, creationism is not entirely out of schools yet, in Colorado, teacher’s cannot denounce religious beliefs, which means that my biology teacher actually had to say ‘This doesn’t mean God couldnt’ have created the earth. . .’ to our class when presenting evolution.
Religion and science should exist seperately, and should not go together. Hell, if the creationists wanted to put their point as a scientific truth, they could have been a little clever rather than just making up bullshit. They could have said that the creation was only seven days to their god, but was of course much longer in the eyes of us mortals, or something like that, and at least kept with scientifically proven facts (well, I don’t believe in facts, but as close to them as you can come). Hell, this is English, the most fucked-up language ever, they should be able to work with science without out-and-out lying.
They’re charging admission? Are they trying to break even, trying to make a profit, or are they trying to raise money to donate to a charity?
My biology teacher just says while we’re studying evolution that this is all a theory, don’t go running to your parents telling them we’re enforcing views on you.
Gravity’s a theory too. And 984: while the bible doesn’t directly say it and that it is indeed an english scholar that thought up the number, it is nonetheless something that is widely accepted by a large number of believers, to the point where uniformitarianism was a schocking concept when it was first brought up (suggesting the Earth was millions of years old). The park/museum as an isolated concept isn’t anything one WOULD worry about. I’d think it was retarded and leave it at that in such a situation (I mean christ, Adam, Eve and a T-Rex). However, the significance of this point is the intent with which this is made and the social context and circumstances. These are sensitive times and therefore, it is important to denounce what is wrong with this and the real issues it stands for, which aren’t christiniaty or a religion as a whole, but the hijacking of important values and the role and most importantly the spread of such a hijacking.
BTW: I love the megaphone idea. I couldn’t help thinking of the scene where the Rock is being laughed at before he attacks the mining city in the rundown. This needs to be done with as large a crowd of people as humanly possible.
As is all around us. Religion or science; when something becomes a threat to personal freedom, it becomes dangerous and should be stopped.
OMG, BOO…
I’m even more ashaimed because my hometown is in Kentucky… >_>
I fucking hate that place. (I love washington!)
For the record, Catholics ARE Christians, which is probably why you can’t tell the difference. The majority of Americans are either Catholic or Protestant of various denominations.
Catholics are just another denomination of Christianity.
I’ve yet to hear a really good explanation as to how creation and evolution are fundamentally different. The way I see it – first there was nothing, then something happened, then there was life, then there was man. Who the hell cares about the details?
Yes, crying seems like an appropriate reaction in this case.
This is very depressing. 80 years after the famous “Scopes Monkey trial” we get a “Creationist Jurassic Park.
A jury was to decide the fate of John Scopes, a high school biology teacher charged with illegally teaching the theory of evolution.
http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/scopes/evolut.htm
Probably most of them will go:
Americans were among the most likely of peoples to believe that “The Bible is the actual word of God and it is to be taken literally word for word” - three times more likely than the Norwegians and nearly five times more likely than the British.
But why?
Socioculturally speaking, the persistence of the religious worldview in America may be due in significant measure, as some scholars have argued, to the strength of the cultural fundamentalist movement in our society in recent years that has succeeded in getting its message and agenda into the public schools, the mass media, and other social institutions. One powerful indicator of the success of this movement is the low level of scientific literacy about human evolution in American society as compared to other developed nations.
http://www.secularhumanism.org/library/fi/bishop_19_3.html
…
Under normal circumstances, I would agree with Hiryuu. Normal being an average philosophical debate. But I hasten to add that this is not normal. This museum is a waste of space and money; in fact I would say that the only positive thing that came out of this mesuem’s creation was the jobs it provided. Sin is right this kind of thing should not be encuraged.
Hiryuu is right that a privately-owned is not cause for distress, but the problem with the Fundamentalists is that they continually try to infiltrate the public domain.
Infiltrating the public domain?
I guess here is something more to cry over
So because someone is putting something up with their own money and you happen to disagree with it, that makes the country a shithole? Well that really is an odd way of looking at things.
And for those of you who don’t agree with Christians or “fundamentalists” that’s fine but remember your opinion isn’t any more valid than someone elses. An opinion can neither be right nor wrong, it seems many of you have forgotten that.
Also RPT you are wrong about science and religion not being able to coexist.
Yeah, but how do you explain wanting to excise evolution from textbooks? Or teach creationism as an alternative to evolution? Or put statues of the Ten Commandments in front of public buildings?
Also, what would your reaction be if a group of Neo-Nazis wanted to open a museum all about how the Jews and blacks are inferior? You would probably be as upset as some in this thread are about this creationism museum.
Science and religion can coexist as long as religion doesn’t try to refute science, and science doesn’t claim to know the answers to religious questions that it can’t know the answers too(such as the existence of God).
I agree with your points about coexistence and the roles of science and religion and I don’t think people should leave evolution out of the curriculum or out of textbooks but many seem to want to demonize people for having a different opinion or believing in religion.
Also on the Neo-Nazi thing the first thing I would want to do is burn it to the ground but unfortunately the first amendment exists which covers everyone, not just certain groups, and allows them to spread their message, so long as it does not incite violence.
We’re not dealing with opinions here. Evolution is not an opinion; it happens whether you believe in it or not. Like gravity. Anyone who wishes to claim anything in opposition to this is welcome to walk off the nearest cliff in order to prove me wrong.
Also, that site you linked to doesn’t reconcile faith with science. It criticizes a certain cult, that’s all. Is it even a serious site?
They wasted a lot of money on that. 0-0
I give you infinity. Take infinity and divide it up infinite times into an infinite number of infinitely smaller but still infinite infinities. By doing so you approach the square root of human stupidity (which, in case you haven’t guessed, is infinity).
There are so many contradictions and unexplainable gaps in the Christian faith that it’s just impossible to believe in. Every devout Christian I’ve debated with on the subject has basically reverted to the idea that “it’s this way because God made it so.” That’s like saying you voted for Bush because you’re a Republican. Is there a reason? No, not really. Just you being dumb.
DISCLAIMER: I am in no way trying or encouraging anyone else to reopen an electoral debate. I’m just using an analogy here.
That’s probably the stupidest thing I’ve ever heard anyone say. That dude sounds lilke a retard.
While I am still christian, I should let you non-creationists know that most christians are not this…I guess dumb is the best way to put it. While we do not believe humankind evolved from apes, it’s quite obvious that the world is much older than a few thousand years. By showing dinosaurs alongside humans, however, the guy who built this place is showing his own ignorance. Don’t be offended by my referring to the bible, but here’s why: Simply, in the bible, God told Noah to build an ark big enough to carry two (one male, one female) of every species, with which to repopulate the earth after the great flood. I forget how long he had to built the ark, but there’s no way he could have made one big enough to have multiple duos of dinosaurs onboard along for the ride. No matter how much time he had, the dimensions would have simply been too much.
Sadly, I’d have to say that this museum is little more than a form of propoganda. Twisting the christian beliefs to make things more appealing to kids is just wrong. This day in age, it’s very important to educate about everything, and let people make the choice for themselves.
On a personal note, keeping the faith gets harder as I go on. Every day, the realm of science seems to offer more explanation (and more common sense) than faith in any religion. This might seem silly, or downright stupid, to you who are not religious, but it’s quite scary for me. I mean, if there’s no afterlife, no heaven, hell, or even no soul, then we’re nothing more than meat machines. This frightens me more than anything else, to think that in the end, it’s all for nothing. I’m not sure what to do about this.
Sorry for the personal rant, it just seemed fitting in this thread. :fungah:
Oh for fucks sake! A christian museum. I cant believe people disbelieve of evolution. Hey they have a right to believe in what they want but come on! We have so much proof. I myself am a christian but I believe that we evolved. Though alot of people dont think I am because I dont act like one. Well by society’s standards anyway. Just because I belive in scientific fact and lots of other shit that I do and like they say that I’m not christian and that I’m going to burn in hell. Anyway about the museum, well you’ve all said what I think. I think its quite stupid. Like Aldred said, its getting harder and harder to believe in christianity. Damn this once great country is going to shit.
I’m very well aware and I fully agree with you that the majority of christians aren’t as dumb as the guy building this museum and this museum represents a minority opinion in our society. However, this minority is quite vocal and knows how to pull its weight and has done what it could to spread its propaganda. Then in the future, it won’t be such a small minority and their impact on society will be most worrisme.
I don’t think that people shouldn’t believe in a deity because of science. I think a lot of people want and need that in their lives. It provides some with meaning, others with comfort. Science probably never will answer the question of a soul, but it can answer the question of how the world around us works for as well as we can measure. I think its more a matter of accepting that a religion is not an entire entity that needs to be accepted or rejected as a whole, but like science, accepted in parts. I’m not saying some parts of science are inherently untrue, but that science doesn’t always have all the answers and that if a model is disproven, then its ok because it doesn’t mean every other model is wrong too. I think Aldred makes a funny point about having one of every male and female on the Ark (even if that’d lead to extinction of all species due to a genetic bottleneck) since well…yeah, have a tyranosaurus coexist with everything else. And don’t forget the room for the brontosauruses. The Ark would make the Titanic look like an inflatable pool boat.