Taiwan/China

The Core RPGC Main Forum
1

Check it out, okay. So <a href=“http://www.cnn.com/2001/ALLPOLITICS/04/25/bush.taiwan.04/”>Bush said at the beginning of his term</a> that he’d send troops to support Taiwan in the event of a war for independence between Taiwan and China.

Now China says, they will absolutely not allow anybody to help split Taiwan from China (since in recent news (this is the IMPORTANT ARTICLE), <a href=“http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapcf/07/31/china.taiwan.arms.ap/index.html”>the U.S. is selling like $18 billion worth of weapons to Taiwan</a>).

"Wang Zaixi, vice minister of the State Council’s Taiwan Affairs Office also said that Beijing will not rule out war with Taiwan if the island’s president pursues his plan to adopt a new constitution by 2008, the newspaper said.

Taiwan President Chen Shui-bian has said he plans to introduce a new constitution for the island when his term ends in 2008."

Dude, so like, Bush is basically blundering into this now-more-than-ever smoldering powder keg between Taiwan and China, all putting his nose into where he really doesn’t know what the fuck is going on. Maaan, I don’t think this’ll escalate into a war, but it’s just a really stupid, pretty scary thing to think of our President doing, and there’s no actual, in-your-face media coverage of it at ALL.

Also, I know it’s the Washington Times and hence a stupid-ass newspaper, but I was just googling around for information about this, and here, check it out: http://washingtontimes.com/national/20040716-123134-8152r.htm

In particular:

"Chinese leaders told National Security Adviser Condoleezza Rice last week that China would “not sit idly by” as Taiwan moved toward formal independence, and President Hu Jintao denounced U.S. weapons sales to Taiwan.

But Miss Rice said the United States will go ahead with its Taiwan arms sales plan because of China’s missile buildup opposite the island.

A Pentagon report made public in May stated that China is changing its warship forces from a coastal defense force to one employing “active offshore defense.”"

What are all your thoughts about this? Like, am I the only one who sees this situation as being potentially really bad?

2

You’re not the only one. A lot of my friends and I have family in Taiwan and China.

3

And the world would go ‘Boom!’.
It’s a pretty frightening prospect. And, unfortunately, not that unlikely to happen.

4

Most, maybe all presidents since Taiwan bacame seperate sold arms to ensure Taiwan’s survival. Even Clinton gave them aid, only less then previpous administrations.

5

Yeah, we’ve been giving Tiawan aid ever since the fifties due to the cold war and communist hunt and such.

Doesn’t seem to be a good idea to get involved now though, in fact, it seem like a horrible idea to get involved with those two countries right now.

6

If war does break out, my money is on China.

7

Oh what the fuck! WHY?! WHY?!

Over the past couple of years, Chinese media has been geared towards Taiwan culture, Taiwan life, Taiwan everything. There’s been so much communcation it’s not even funny. There’s a fucking show about Taiwan on the mainland news network <i>all the time</i>, where people debate and talk all the time, and when things <i>might</i> be solved diplomatically, this <i>idiot</i> comes in with his announcement and draws unwanted, hostile attention to the issue, messes with something <i>he has no clue about</i>, and <i>quite possibly</i> further alienates world powers from the United States, of fucking America.

I think he’s just fucking up the country as much as possible so the next president won’t be <i>bored in office</i>, or something.

8

I haven’t even heard anything on that up here in Vancouver Maz- and I watch the news every morning and evening. That’s really upsetting me, not only the lack of open information, but the topic itself.

I really hope this will cool down… if not it’s going to get really cold soon for anyone left after the nukes.

:kissy:

9

Not saying I’m with Bush on this, but according to this, China has stated it’s gonna take over Taiwan, or at least make sure they do not get a constitution. It’s a tad bit revolting that a world power such as China would go through such lengths to, you know, take over Taiwan.

Then again, Bush has no freaking right to immerse himself and the US into something that DOESN’T CONCERN THEM.

10

Expecialy after they got Hong Kong back a couple of years ago, i mean common China, how many pacific islands do you need? Whats next? Spratly? Natuna? Andaman?

11

Hong Kong’s different. It was <i>conquered</i> by England (“loaned”). It most certainly isn’t part of England.

12

Eh. It probably wont go anywhere bad… but i have heard that Taiwan might be planning to (fight if necessary) gain their independence sometime in 2006… according to some show on the Chinese CCTV 4 that my parents watch all the time… dont know excatly why 2006 tho… >.> or maybe i’m mistaken. Hopefuly i’m mistaken…

13

Taiwan could wreack some major damage in China, by themselves and without our help, if it came to war.

The official position of the U.S. government is that we support peaceful reunification. Yet we keep selling weapons to Taiwan. It seems to me that we secretly dont want Taiwan to ever become part of communist China.

14

Prolly. Also the current DDP leader of Taiwan is a pretty staunch Christian, which I’m sure Bush digs on, cause that’s the kind of person our president is.

Though I think it’s also just a case of genuine stupidity - I think Bush thinks he’s doing a genuinely good, moral thing, supporting “the little guys” in their “fight for freedom” against the Evil Empire. But he’s not realizing that it’s way more complicated than that.

15

Taiwan and China main land is two country? Who told you that?
Taiwan is a part of China since the emperor Sun Quan (Maybe you know him in some games, my great ancestor) take this place 1900 years ago. Where’s the United states 1900 years ago?
Taiwan really got sepereted because China civil war in 1945. The war would have end then without US’s help. For the one who win the war is the Communist Party, American helped the other side, keep then alive in Taiwan. Many family like mine, were sepereted for more than 50 years, just because the stupid American hate Communists. Now you even want Taiwan got independence?
Taiwan got independence is nothing tor you? How about Hawaii got independence from the United states?
99% people in China support the war begin(continue?) right now. To kill those who want to get Taiwan independence (someone like Chen Shuibian, he want to be his president right? ). If US or Japan still want to get involved, we just start a war against them.

16

…Bush already has Iraq under his belt, there’s no way he’d push the envelope on TWO, actually, three countries, would he? The American won’t go for that unless some Taiwanse or Chinese attack disturbs us from our lustful sleep of safety. I doubt that’ll happen, though, fool me once, shame me you…fool me twice…shame on Bush.

17

Being a Chinese, just something a have to say

We are preparing for the war now.
The food price went up all over China these days. We all know the reason that it is the army who bought a large part of it, for the war.

18

The irony is staggering.

Politics are ALWAYS more complex than they initially appear. That’s why I dislike conservatives AND liberals. They hardly ever consider the other’s side before damning them for being wrong. So, in a way, almost everybody involved in politics (including teenagers discussing politics on an RPG message board (ie random, Moore-esque Bush-bashing)) is guilty of the exact same thing you’re accusing Bush of (having a black & white mentality and not realizing the complexity of the issue before acting or speaking). …I would say that most politicians are probably less guilty of it than regular folk who sit around bitching about politics, though.

There are two sides to every issue, folks. Try to give each an equal chance.

19

Acutally, Maz, i think the reason the US wants China and Taiwan to be in constant conflict is that it doesnt want China to have too much military power in the Pacific. Look, to the east of Chinese coastline, there’s Korea, Japan, and Taiwan. All three are US allies. Currently, both Korea and Japan want the Americans out, which now only leaves Taiwan as an US ally. If a war does break out, i’m not sure if the US still will help Taiwan, but for now, they’ll offer whatever help they can to keep up the containment.

20

So you’re saying that the people in china think a war is imminent? (going to happen very soon)? Thats a really scary thought. =\