Earthbound

The Core Video Games Forum
1

Just beat it for the first time. Not bad, but I don’t see what the commotion is about. Very schizophrenic, lots of pointless (not necessarily funny or intended to be funny) things. Will write review later when I have time, perhaps tonight or tomorrow afternoon.

Discuss game.

EDIT: Review up!

Earthbound is the kind of game that invokes crazy feelings from those who have played it. Those who dislike the game treat it like a humiliating experience they never want to talk about again, while those who enjoy the game treat it as a euphoric memory that they can’t adequately put words to. I was in the middle camp, simply thinking it was a passable game, so I guess that means I’ll be able to put words to the experience. I wonder, though, if that makes me the most qualified or the least qualified person to complete the task?

It’s easy to see why no one can adequately summarize Earthbound: there’s truly nothing quite like it (except for maybe the NES Earthbound Zero, which had a lot of ideas and plot points ripped directly from it). If I had to describe it in a word, though, I’d use “schizophrenic.” The main appeal (or drawback) of the game is that it’s simply all over the place. There’s so much to like about Earthbound, but there’s also so much to hate about it, which probably explains my extreme ambivalence towards the game.

Take the gameplay, for example. Earthbound’s interface and combat is ‘retro’ even for its decidedly old age, deliberately made to play like an old Dragon Quest game (i.e heavily menu-driven, low emphasis on visuals), which were finally beginning to go out of style at around the time of its release. Some of this is okay; I definitely enjoyed the Dragon Quest-style combat, which took advantage of every opportunity to be funny and parody the RPG genre. It may not be flashy or interesting to look at, but only in text-narrated battles can you have an attack that reads “The UFO fired a laser beam which causes nighttime stuffiness!” The backgrounds even augment the humor by consisting entirely of wacky flashing patterns, which sort of suggests that your party members are just hallucinating (and what better way to justify getting into a battle with a taxi?)

The antiquated presentation OUT of battles, however, just seems obnoxious and unnecessary. What’s interesting and immersive about having several menus to talk and examine your surroundings? Is it really funny to have to eat a sandwich just to be able to run for a short amount of time? I guess the answer is ‘yes’, but is it really THAT funny? What is cool about never, ever knowing how to progress the game? This hurts the experience much more than it helps.

Lastly, in case you were curious about the game’s difficulty, it’s very weird. Random battles are strangely difficult, and you have to do a fair share of grinding before you can handle them. Bosses, on the other hand, are a different story: you can kill most of them by using the auto-battle function. Only about two bosses besides the last boss can not be defeated by using auto-battle, which seems a little unrewarding.

The story is equally inconsistent in its delivery. A meteor crashes into the earth close to the main character’s house in the middle of the night. He goes to investigate it, and a bee tells him that he has to stop an alien invasion. So, then, he has to go and find eight locations and record part of a melody from each location into a stone he got from the bee.

…But, why? The melodies are ultimately not crucial to the narrative. In fact, all they wind up doing is making Ness (the main character) really strong. You could easily beat the last boss without having all of Ness’s stats boosted to absurd proporitions. At the very least, Earthbound Zero (which Earthbound took several cues from) made the eight melodies a necessary factor in defeating the final boss. It feels more like an afterthought in this game (as many of the parts ripped off from EBZero do - Magicant, anyone?), as Ness and Co. move from town to town and see quirky goings-on.

Or, for example, the game focuses heavily on humor and sattire of things such as American culture and the RPG genre in general. …At least, it does at the beginning. After a while, the game just sprinkles quirky, pointless ‘jokes’ here and there. While it never feels really out of place or forced, it’s strange that the game gives way to trying to take its absurd plot more seriously as you progress further into the game.

Even better (or worse?), how about the intensely creepy final boss fight, which was apparently inspired by a traumatic experience of the lead designer’s childhood? Why have a goofy, nonsensical tone for 99% of the game, to throw an intentionally unnerving experience at the very end? It wass really uncomfortable, because I wasn’t sure exactly HOW I should feel at that point; the entire game had been silly-billy-gumdrops up to that point, so it came off as awkward to me, where in any other game, I probably would have felt a more powerful dramatic effect. Even worse, IMMEDIATELY after the boss fight ends, the jokes come right back (“Ness! Now, I…well…It’s going to seem like I’m running away…”).

To be honest, it feels like the lead designer, Shigesato Itoi, wants to tell us something serious, but is too scared to try and show a moment of vulnerability. This makes sense to me; I’ve heard Mother 3 (the Japanese-only sequel) is a very serious game, and Earthbound’s NES predecessor is much more consistently funny throughout. In fact, I would wager that Earthbound’s schizophrenic presentation is the result of a hesitant attempt to try and say something truly meaningful. It’s hard to point out every last little part, but it feels like the various situations and different parts of the narrative are laboring at SOMETHING, but I can’t put my finger on what.

So, while the game was an interesting experience that I don’t regret having, I would definitely never play it again and I can’t wholly recommend it to anyone. If anything, though, playing Earthbound has sparked my interest in seeing what Mr. Itoi has to offer me intellectually, if anything. Maybe it’s finally time to give Mother 3 a shot?

2

I just love this game. It’s so charming, and the music is great.

there are a few questionable scenes that I interrupt as kids taking psychedelic drugs; drinking the tea from Mr. Saturn, eating the magic cake and have the dream about Poo, there are a few others too that slip my mind.

3

It took you this long to finally beat it? Damn.

Anyhow, it’s still a great game. Most people like it because it deviates from the standard RPG norm. And quite a few like the funny (if nonsensical) humor. It doesn’t really take itself too seriously.

4

I start this game every so often, fully intending to beat it. I never get very far. That’s all I can really say.

Do you think I should force myself to play it SG? If I trust anyone’s judgment on games here it’s yours.

5

To this day I have not been able to beat EB. I played five or six hours back in the day, but the awful interface turned me off. I can see what people see in it, it’s definitely quirky and unusual, but without a more enjoyable gameplay system I couldn’t get far enough.

6

I’ve still never played this game, but now I eagerly await the SG review.

7

I dunno. To be honest, this is my second try, too. There’s a part near the halfway point of the game, where you do events in this town called Fourside…it’s about 2-3 hours of “wtf do I do now” “how was I ever supposed to know that” events rolled up into one agonizing section. The first time I played, I got through this part, but I was so frustrated that I didn’t keep going (the fact that the game’s humor tapers off big time at around that part didn’t help either). To be honest, I almost stopped again, but I forced myself to keep going this time.

I think it was worth it to beat it once, but mostly just to be educated on the subject of Earthbound, but to be honest, the first parts of the game are easily the best. I certainly would never, ever play it again, even though there were a few funny parts. If anything, I’d say to try Earthbound Zero, which was a lot funnier in my opinion…although, it is very, very grindey. I hear Mother 3 is really good too, but I haven’t tried it yet. Maybe now’s the time for me to finally give it a whirl?

Anyways, I’m feeling really tired for some reason, so I’ll write up my review tonight and edit it into my first post. I’ll let you guys know when I do.

8

I can recommend Mother 3, for sure. It might be hard to believe after coming from Earthbound, but the story is bookended by two very powerful emotional parts. All the stuff in the middle is more reminiscent of Earthbound though. Though I found it to be a much more enjoyable game to play, even if the ‘beat combo’ system took a bit of getting used to.

9

Mother 3 is fantastic. I really reccomend playing it. IMO it has the best story of any game I’ve played. Like Spoony said the most powerful bits of the story are at the beginning and the end, but the stuff between is still good. I find that the two major villains are especially well done.

The gameplay isn’t changed that much. However, I find that dungeons are usually shorter, and the longer ones are very important to the plot so the game has pretty good pacing.

10

greatest game of all time? or the greatest game of all time?

other than a short slew of other games I can’t think of at the moment

11

Two things:

  1. I got a second wind shortly after posting on here, and I finished the review. It will be up within seconds after I post this message. Also, as an added bonus for impatient readers: it’s one of the shortest reviews I’ve ever written - uncomfortably short for my tastes, in fact.

  2. I said that the beginning is the only part worth playing…well, I guess the end is pretty worth it, even if it feels inappropriate with the tone of the rest of the game. If you don’t want to play through it, read my review and then read about the end moments of Earthbound here:

http://www.destructoid.com/blogs/Scary+Womanizing+Pig+Mask/the-hidden-themes-of-the-end-of-earthbound-as-recommenced-by-chad-concelmo--79495.phtml

Although, I have to say that I don’t agree with most of his interpretations of musical aspects (and a few other things), it’s interesting to listen to the music while you read it.

12

I think that Mother 3 is very good, but I feel that it doesn’t quite develop many of its promising themes. It has many emotional and lyrical moments, though. On the whole, I’d give a slight edge to Earthbound because it’s more light-hearted, and it has a bigger world for you to explore (Mother 3 only has three towns, and you only really spend any time in one of them).

I agree with you that the game changes toward the end, but I think it’s just because there are more dungeons and “no-man’s-land” type areas, and fewer modern settings. Much of the appeal, for me, comes from the towns in the game, so after Summers, I start to enjoy it a bit less (though the later parts have their moments). But even before then, I wouldn’t call it “silly-billy-gumdrops.” The game isn’t really a comedy, much less a satire. I think it is better described as “deadpan.” It keeps throwing completely outrageous things at you, but it also has serious tones, it’s not just being “ironic.”

The final boss battle is the clearest example of this, since it’s just plain disturbing, but really the whole game is like that. The Moonside segment is not comic or satirical; it’s just incredibly bizarre. But I think it’s also amazingly creative – the writing in that part is very inventive, and excellent at creating a totally disconcerting feeling. The same can be said for the blue cult, or Magicant, or even the zombie segment in Threed, which is really more odd than funny.

To me, the primary appeal of the game lies in its eccentric, dream-like logic. The story is not quite a completely random collection of laughs, there’s a fairly consistent narrative running through it. But the logic of the narrative only works in the bizarre setting. Here’s a fairly long quote that I think could be applied to this kind of situation:

Sometimes one dreams strange, impossible and incredible dreams; on awakening you remember them and are amazed at a strange fact. You remember first of all that your reason did not desert you throughout the dream; you remember even that you acted very cunningly and logically through all that long, long time, while you were surrounded by murderers who deceived you, hid their intentions, behaved amicably to you while they had a weapon in readiness, and were only waiting for some signal; you remember how cleverly you deceived them at last, hiding from them; then you guessed that they’d seen through your deception and were only pretending not to know where you were hidden; but you were sly then and deceived them again; all this you remember clearly. But how was it that you could at the same time reconcile your reason to the obvious absurdities and impossibilities with which your dream is overflowing? One of your murderers turned into a woman before your very eyes, and the woman into a little, sly, loathsome dwarf – and you accepted it all at once as an accomplished fact, almost without the slightest surprise, at the very time when, on another side, your reason was at its highest tension and showed extraordinary power, cunning, sagacity and logic?

I think this is basically how Earthbound works. Itoi likes to tell fairly serious and even dark stories (Mother 3), but he feels compelled to put them in this weird, off-the-wall setting. Mother 3 is even more like this, since the dark parts are much darker, and the weird parts are very flamboyant. I see how many people would not be interested in that, but I personally quite enjoy it. Although it’s not something I’d go for every day.

13

Back when I obsessively collected EVERYTHING in a game, I hated Earthbound. Why? The Sword of Kings. It has like a 1/360 drop rate on a specific enemy that exists in a very tiny portion of the game. I completely gave up on getting it when I reached MAXIMUM LEVEL during this portion of the game.

As far as story is concerned… I disagree when you say Earthbound is inconsistent. Thematically it’s a story about childhood, and the destruction of innocence. The heroes of the game are children, but constantly called upon to act as adults without any of the benefits that entails. Ness’ father is never seen; he considers caring for his son nothing more than throwing massive amounts of money at him. He’s almost like an employer rather than a father, giving you money based on how much work you do. The people you meet gleefully let you throw yourself into mortal danger, and yet they consistently treat you as children despite this. I suppose one could see this as a stab at conventional RPGs (as well as fantasy novels), which often have youths saving the world. If it wasn’t for Gigyas acting like a child throughout your final “fight” with him, I would say that is it.

Even think of the main villain throughout the game. Pokey is picked on, abused by his parents, and generally has non-childlike ambitions. His innocence has been destroyed before the meteor even hits. Because of this, he seeks to align himself with Gigyas so that he can destroy everyone else’s childhood/innocence. Then again, I haven’t played in a while, but I’m pretty sure I’m correct.

14

Earthbound is really hit-or-miss to a lot of people, but the people who liked it, loved it. Of course, not everyone goes into the particulars of the story or the bosses (of which the final boss is an obviously fucked-up affair).

Definitely play Mother 3 if you can, though it’s much darker and serious than EB. Mother 3 really just hits on your emotions, as it has some very powerful and touching parts. It’s interesting how it takes on a serious story in a very bizzare world.

GAP: Was the Sword of Kings that hard for you get? I always got it every playthrough. Probably the easiest rare weapon to get since you can abuse back attacks for the encounters. But that was the only 1/128 item I ever really went after. The rest you can’t really easily abuse the encounters.

15

I rather like Earthbound, though I wouldn’t say I love it. I agree that after a certain point I tend to lose interest - immediately after Dungeon Man, and when I need to enter Deep Darkness. That’s the point I always need to force myself past. And I always try to get the Sword of Kings, but I never really get it, or care. Poo’s magic is good enough as it is.

16

Looking at it objectively, Earthbound is not without its flaws, but I love it anyway. I really can’t say what it is about it that appeals to me so. It just has a certain charm, I guess.

17

Max level while farming for the sword of kings. lol. you never really tried to get the sword of kings huh

and the end of the game has everything to do with the tone of the game

it’s a big joke taken way too seriously, a play on life!

18

I did. On an emulator. With the ` key. Maybe I was just unlucky, but I didn’t get the damned sword.

19

I can kind of see what SK and GAP are saying, and it’s actually a bit enlightening to see it from those perspectives. Still, I think I’ll stick to my guns.

I wouldn’t necessarily say that the game is not a satire. At the very least, most aspects of the gameplay are obviously satirizing the genre. One clear example is “LSD battles”, but another is just the way that people try to give you game advice. “You can view the town map with the X button. …You know. Near the top. Haha.”

There are other things that seem to just poke fun or make obvious nods at American culture, such as “I just got done reading this book called ‘our society is so convenient.’” Or, who didn’t chuckle at the Carbon Dog becoming the Diamond Dog? I guess the theme of Diamond Dogs is technically serious, but that is just silly to me.

In fact, just a lot of things add to the ‘silly billy’ tone to me. The Escargo Express is what just really does it for me; can you imagine telling someone a story like this about your job? “I met up with this guy in Twoson to pick up some of his stuff, and he gave me two cookies and a bomb.” That’s hysterical!

The dreamlike logic is a cool take, and I can recognize that. Personally, though, while I think that can work for some people, it creates a really awkward situations for me. When I finally saw the final boss sequence, for example it just felt really uncomfortable because of the overall presentation of the rest of the game.

It felt kind of like… let’s say I’m at a party, and there’s this guy who wasn’t drunk quite yet, but he’s had enough drinks to loosen his mouth, and he’s telling me these ‘funny’ anecdotes of things his parents said or did to him when he was little. Obviously, these things are not funny, but he’s kind of just telling you, while you’re in the middle of this feelgood situation, and he’s not even necessarily telling you in a way that would indicate that he’s disturbed about it. Do you laugh? Do you tell him “uhh, I don’t wanna hear that?” What if that exacerbates the situation? It’s just an intimidating position to be placed in, and it feels really inappropriate. To that end, I think the style harms the narrative more than it helps.

As for what GAP says about the childhood/destruction of innocence theme, I personally don’t think this was deliberate, for a number of reasons:

  1. Having played Earthbound Zero, EB on SNES takes a lot of cues from that game, including a lot of the ones you mentioned, but there are virtually no emotionally heavy parts of that game; it’s pretty much 100% funny.

  2. Take a look at, let’s say at least 50% of JRPGs (probably more); they pretty much all consist of 12-16 years olds saving the world against unfathomable crazy evil guys. You even get insight into their struggle, and they’re never upset, distressed, or generally perturbed by it. Even then, all the playable characters are happy to just meet up and accompany Ness on his adventure. There’s no indication that they’re any worse for wear because of it.

  3. I also disagree with your interpretation of the final boss: to me, the final boss’ actions and words are reminiscent of a person of undisclosed age, being raped or murdered. This was also just strange to me, because having seen no reason for this in the game, it felt completely out of left field to throw it in.

  4. Most importantly…The game in general, and especially the ending sequence, doesn’t seem to thoughtfully explore the implications theme to any extent. In fact, one of the last things that happens in the game is Ness going through a photo album of his adventure with his mom, all comprised of photos which he smiled and posed for. If the theme truly is the loss of childhood innocence, what exactly is that sort of ending trying to say? “Oh well?” “No big deal?” If it’s no big deal, why even try to make a narrative about it?

20

I’m going to bed in like… two seconds so I’ll only respond to this point for now. Remember what you said about My World My Way, about it necessarily having bad elements for it to satirize bad RPGs? I know that you don’t consider Earthbound a satire, but it definitely pokes a lot of fun at the RPG genre in general, and I believe that the theme I’ve seen closely relates to the fact that other games have high instances of kid/teenage heroes.