Shovanistic vs. Personal Preference

The Core RPGC Main Forum
21

Whether or not you think a person is attractive is opinion. Whether or not you think it’s right or wrong to base your sexual/relational decisions on physicality is an issue of morality, and if you’re going to argue that morality is somehow relative or subjective, then you’re the one not contributing anything to the discussion. Saying that, I realize I might have overemphasized my argument that people always look toward physicality first. While I think that’s true, I think what the real argument here is whether or not holding physicality strongly in relation to other attributes such as personality or religion or whatever is shallow. I think we can all agree we first see the physical, but for some of us that might not be as important, so as we learn more about a person we might change our mind. I think this is a truism also. But, when you get down to the meat of what one considers important in a relationship, after all things have been considered then is it right to be so shallow?

I still think this is fine. I happen to feel that physical attraction is important to me, even years into a relationship. Regardless of how I feel towards a person, I have to be able to look them in the eye and tell them I think they are beautiful, and a large part of that for me involves keeping up outward appearances. I don’t think it’s right for anyone to tell you otherwise, because as I said this is an issue of morality, not opinion. If you feel that my, or anyone else’s, dependence on physical attraction is shallow, then I think you’ve got some other issues going on, be it jealousy, spite, or whatever.

But then there is always an issue of chaos involved. Sometimes people are just lucky I suppose, and end up with someone they, or others, might consider above them. Nor does it mean that a person who does not feel strongly about physical attraction can end up with a physically attractive person. Hell, anything can happen.

22

Good point Skankin’, but going by that reasoning, you’d have to lower your standards to only dating dumb people, for fear that the smart ones would screw you over. Realistically, unless you have an extremely high-paying job which promises wealth and security forever, most woman aren’t going to trade their time, money, or sexual favors for your company.

23

First off, what the hell are you even arguing? SG said and I’ll quote this:

You’re attacking an arguement that he didn’t make, nice one. Next time read the damn post before you respond to it. Secondly, that last line is just fucking sexist. You say that like every woman on the planet isn’t going to put out unless the guy can reinforce his penis with a wad of bills.

24

It almost sounds like you’re saying that people that aren’t smart aren’t as good. That’s kinda rude, don’t you think? Just about EVERYONE is intelligent, whether you wanna believe it or not, and thinking anything else is just cynical. Maybe you’ve just met some mean, callous people in your life. They’re not all that way, and there’s more to a person than superficial intelligence. Intelligence is too subjective; there’s lots of different kinds of intelligence, and everyone has some intelligence. It seems like your definition of intelligence is a little vague, is what I’m trying to say. Like I said in my first post, what makes loving someone for their beauty any more shallow than liking them for any other one characteristic? Intelligence doesn’t make it any better.

In any case, I never said “One should never date a smart person in fear that their trust will be broken.” I simply was responding to your statement: “To have a relationship there has to be trust, and you cannot trust an idiot.” To say “you cannot trust an idiot” is really kind of rude; you’re saying that no one that is “intelligent” can be trusted. Plus, after I made my last post, you’re now saying that I’ve made a good point in saying that your statement was incorrect.

By the way:

“Realistically, unless you have an extremely high-paying job which promises wealth and security forever, most woman aren’t going to trade their time, money, or sexual favors for your company.”

Tell that to any girl, and see what happens. :stuck_out_tongue: That’s a rude generalization, and if you’ve talked to a lot of girls, you should know that this just isn’t true.

25

You can alter your appearance, if you really want to. For instance, studies show that drinking two cans of beer makes the average person 25% more attractive (based on others’ reactions). Alcohol causes a person to relax his facial expression and pose, and smile more. However, alcohol isn’t necessary to do this. You can make yourself look different, based on your habitual pose and expression. Look at your acquaintances who have had major personality changes at some point. Haven’t their appearance and attractiveness changed as well?

I think the reason people care about appearance is that it reflects the person inside. Looking messy and unkempt? That’s a sign of a messy interior. Smiling? A person who means well. Wide-eyed? A person who’s hopeful.

There’s nothing shallow about being influenced by someone’s appearance.

26

My opinion is this. Dating a girl based on physical attraction is usually(not always) a superficial decision. But based on my experiences, one who is an obese, ugly duckling usually has some serious issues(which is why I’ve never dated one). And me, being the kind of person who can’t trust anybody, I usually go for girls who have at least some semblance of intellect, because though I can’t trust them, nor bring myself to, I’m usually thinking ahead of them at all times. Dumb girls and me do not work. Period. Plus most girls don’t get into the things I do(such as chess, political debate, and D&D), and the sad thing is, I didn’t cook meals for any woman based on my feelings. I cooked meals because I was better at it than any girl I’ve dated(man what luck is that??). And because of the drama associated with dating, I have stopped doing so for about four years and now take one night stands when I can get them. And I don’t plan to get back into the dating circle since I am again living at home. Maybe someday, I’ll fall in love. But for now, I think love is an illusion clouded by visions of lust and grandieur. But to some, that’s what makes the chase fun. I really don’t think any of this is informative to anybody, it might be just senseless rambling from a senseless BBS poster.

27

But for now, I think love is an illusion clouded by visions of lust and grandeur. But to some, that’s what makes the chase fun. I really don’t think any of this is informative to anybody, it might be just senseless rambling from a senseless BBS poster.
Not senseless at all. Or at least, you’re absolutely right.

28

OMG!!!

Climbs onto the soapbox

each person has made good points but still bounces around the facts.
People are shallow by genetics. Men are genetically(sp) attracted to the woman that will provide the best young for him, just like women are genetically (sp again) attracted to the guy who will provide for her and her young. that is the way of nature. Smoe have accepted their lot in life and don’t really care what people think about them (the ones who people have said “let themselves go” (a shallow comment in itself)).
we all will look at the best looking people first. that is life. live with it.
what matters is how you treat the ones you don’t look at first. They are after all still human beings with feelings. some people may be more talented than other (in cooking as stated earlier), but from experience everyone tries to do their best for a person that interests them.
Life isn’t always fair. if anyone ever said it was was lying. I take life as it is. no one is bad, ugly, stupid, etc. unless they choose to be. and even then I don’t walk away from those. I have know ALOT of people in my life and each person is in control of their life, albeit some choose to have their life in the control of others.
Damn, starting to rant and I don’t want to.
My point is, like each person for who they are not what they look like, think like, etc. The (forgive my judgemental statement) Ugliest, Dumbest, most disgusting person in the world can end up being just the person you need in your life. You never really know what you need until you have missed it.

jumps off the soapbox and goes for a soda

29

I only skimmed this thread… but here’s how I see it:

Looks and personality go hand-in-hand. Let’s compare:

<b>Not-so-attractive girls…</b>

  • Are always the ones who complain about guys being shallow.
  • Are always the ones who call attractive girls “slutty.”
  • Are always the ones who accuse guys of ignoring personality.
  • Don’t realize that by doing these three things, <i>THEIR</i> personality is the lacking one.
  • Are therefore hypocrites.

<b>Attractive girls…</b>

  • Don’t have anything to complain about.
  • Are by no means brainless.
  • Therefore are more pleasant to be around based on looks AND personality.

So yeah, looks reflect more than just aesthetics.

30

Someone who has an avatar of a woman with bouncing boobies has no right to talk about cheuvanism or being shallow. :-p

31

I hope you’re not serious. Don’t throw around your complete blanket statements. Sorry to say, but what you’ve listed tends to be completely wrong. Attractive girls still do tend to complain, just like anyone else. Don’t just glamorize someone because they’re attractive and act like they have no faults.

32

Kag, remember who you’re referring to: Hades is the master of blanket statements based solely on personal opinion and often far too small population sample to be called an authority in just about any field.

And attractive girls can whine their fair share as well, most of the time about their boyfriend or potential prey.

33

34

Whats it called when you think all women are too good for you?

35

Low self esteem.

36

I think you misunderstand me. I’m not attacking anything, I was politely responding to this:

Furthermore, I was not saying that women “won’t put out unless you have a large sum of bills”. I was simply furthering my response to SG, saying that smart women aren’t just waiting on some guy to date them, so they can misuse his trust and take advantage. There was nothing sexist said; if anything, it was anti-sexist.

At least, it was meant to be that way. If you were offended, then know I didn’t mean it to be.

Now, SG, I guess it is rude to say that unsmart people aren’t as good as the smart ones, perhaps its rude to say that I have no interest in them, but I dunno why it’s being pointed out in such a dark matter. Most people would say “no fat chicks”, or “no freckles”, whatever. For me, intelligence is as important as beauty, and I’m not just talking about book smarts. Common sense, survival instinct, motivation to succeed are very important. If someone doesn’t have those, I simply have no time for them. Rude? I guess so.
The point is, people with low intelligence are sheep. It’s mean and sad, but it’s true. They are the mindless masses who believe everything they hear on TV, and do what they’re told, never take advantage of life; the people that get taken advantage of, screwed over, robbed, beaten, and so on.

Now, I’m not saying that if you get hurt in life, you’re unintelligent; everyone gets hurt now and then. This is just how I see things. I might come off as condescending, or just an asshole, but that’s how I see it.
Of course, we agree to disagree and see things differently; I haven’t lived your life, and you have not experienced mine.

37

<font size=“7”><b><i>SHIT!!! YOU PROVED MY <u>OPINION</u> WRONG!!!</i></b></font>

So sorry, but my “wrong” statements are the single only thing I’ve ever experienced, that deal with shallowness, in my life. I could tell you not to throw around your theory, and try to argue more practically.

And you’re preaching to the wrong guy about about galmorizing attractive women, seriously.

Kag, remember who you’re referring to: Hades is the master of blanket statements based solely on personal opinion and often far too small population sample to be called an authority in just about any field.
Zero, do you just sit around waiting to jump at the chance to insult me, whether it be accurate or not? Here’s a blanket statement for you: You’re DUMB! ;_;

And attractive girls can whine their fair share as well, most of the time about their boyfriend or potential prey.
I’ve never seen one argue about shallowness. Oh oh oh but you can counter that by saying I “must not get out much,” can’t you? Sorry, but it just doesn’t happen very often. It’s my opinion against yours though, and people WILL senselessly side with you. Some may even sensibly side with you, which is what I’m hoping so we can actually start a debate here.

38

I think what Epic is saying, and what I’m reiterating, is I never ever said that. I used it as an example to prove my main point, which I put right at the end of that first post i directed towards you : “Intelligence has nothing to do with trust. The only thing that has to do with trust is showing that you can be trusted. :P”

Now, SG, I guess it is rude to say that unsmart people aren’t as good as the smart ones, perhaps its rude to say that I have no interest in them, but I dunno why it’s being pointed out in such a dark matter. Most people would say “no fat chicks”, or “no freckles”, whatever. For me, intelligence is as important as beauty, and I’m not just talking about book smarts. Common sense, survival instinct, motivation to succeed are very important. If someone doesn’t have those, I simply have no time for them. Rude? I guess so.

Great! That’s what I’ve been saying the whole time. Liking someone for any one character trait is just as allegedly shallow as liking someone based on their looks. Consequently, I don’t think either option is better or worse, and while I do not date people based on just one thing, I can condone others doing so. In any case, I think you are making some completely contradictory statements. You’ve told me “People that choose their partners based on looks are shallow,” you’ve told me “Intelligence is just as important as beauty” (whatever you mean by intelligence), and you have now told me “Choosing a partner based on intelligence is just fine because people choose their partners based on beauty, which is no better.” You seem to be trying to taking both sides.

And lastly, I have very little to say about your last comments. Tons of intelligent people I know believe lots of things they hear on TV, do what they’re told, never seize opportunities that they are given, get taken advantage of, screwed over, robbed, and beaten. I still have absolutely no idea what you mean by intelligence, as you seem to change the definition and throw it in at places where it fits. Please define tell me specifically what you mean by intelligence if you want to continue.

39

Yes, someone pointed out my avatar… I guess the truth must come out finally.

I LIKE BOOBIES!

There? happy? I’m shallow! Yayz!

40

I LIKE BOOBIES TOO :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: :smiley: