Hmmmm interesting....

Yup. They’re apparently looking at (and found) ways for the bans on torture to be legally (in word if not in spirit) allowed. It’s sick, and yet another reason Bush needs to be ousted.

Oh, nice. Undermine human rights, ignore the Geneva Conventions, international laws, U.N, make horrible crimes legal… hello, Mideval times! Bush and ALL his men needs to go before they start WWIII. At this point, it wouldn’t surprise me one bit.

Well it’s not liek the neoconservatices care about any rights but thier own.

The biggest problem here is, those laws were created to be folloed by everybody to ensure a minimal of convivence and thrust for everybody. The moment one breaks the laws, others will feel inclined to do the same. Sooner or later there will be no more law and we will involuntarily move on to a semi-anarchism ruling the world.

Let’s recap: Not only did Rumsfeld know that torture was occurring in Iraq, but long before that, just before the war began, he asked for this report (56 pages is only the part that has leaked out so far), which rationalized torture, attempted to create a legal basis for it, and listed ways for torturers to avoid being put on trial. For instance, it uses the Nuremberg trials as a guide to finding ways of getting away with committing war crimes.

But the worst part of it goes beyond even that. “To protect subordinates should they be charged with torture, the memo advised that Mr. Bush issue a ‘presidential directive or other writing’ that could serve as evidence, since authority to set aside the laws is ‘inherent in the president.’” (“Pentagon Report Set Framework For Use Of Torture,” Wall Street Journal, 6/7/04)

The basic, fundamental principle of a <i>constitutional monarchy</i>, not to mention a <i>democracy</i>, is that the law is above the leader, and the leader in fact does <i>not</i> have any “inherent” authority to dispense with any law he doesn’t like. That the exact opposite is now being asserted as fact shows how little the administration cares about democracy. The memo doesn’t limit this authority to prisoners of war or non-citizens, either. According to it, it is permissible to torture anyone on Bush’s say-so. Essentially, it makes Bush into a king. The neoconservatives literally fancy that they’re too good for laws.

Uh, wait. Are they seriously trying to say, oh hey, it’s unconstitutional for America to comply with international law! That’s so fucking retarded when you think about it, you know? Not only is the Bush administration trying to find loopholes in the US Constitution to justify what they’re doing, but they’re assuming that this lawyerial wrangling somehow gives them the authority to transcend international law too? Like, they don’t even pay lip service to it, it was so silly to read that, it’s like, lawyers were arguing that the Constitution gives the US Commander in Chief has all this authority to override certain laws during wartime, which is true, even if not to the extent that they’re trying to say. But even so, that only applies to laws DETAILED IN THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION. Not international law, not the Geneva Conventions, not the agreements between nations concerning human rights. I mean, why the hell would their argument even make SENSE?

Oh man, this is such a piece of shit, I really hope he’s not re-elected, but I’m afraid he will be because the Democratic candidate is such an uncharismatic bore. Urgh. At least I can vote this November.

Amazing how Clintonian they’ve become with their hand caught in the cookie jar.

When the definition becomes inconvenient, just change the definition.

“Well, it depends on what your definition of torture is. Torture’s a bit too harsh of a word, I think abuses is more apt.” [because after all “abuse” is totally okay, we’re all down with people being abused. That’s no prob, right?]

I half expect one of them to come out and say that they did not have tortural relations with those prisoners. [Since the world should be “torturous” I guess this would come from Dub himself.]

With the considerable difference that America seemed to come off not at all in bad shape at the end of the Clinton presidency. :\

I hope to God Blair doesn’t start with his own version of this shit.

sounds like pretty standard power abuses to me. give the general direction of D.C. the finger

Oh man…

Sort of makes me regret om not living in the US…

And you wanna know why?
Because now I can’t vote against Bush in the next election…

So if someone feels like cheating and voting twice, vote once for me too…

… Oh gods. Humans are such fascinating creatures.

This is pure bullshit. The United States oversaw and ratified international laws passed by the United Nations, and now the administration wants to violate not only international laws, but national laws as well? And all this to “ensure the safety of the United States”, which had never been threatened in the first place. Disgusting.

People who actually believe this frighten me. It’s like… how can you be so complacent as to not see what’s going on around you?

If he is re-elected, I am going to begin fearing for my life… yet, it makes you wonder, what other countries have horrable Bush-like dictartors in power right now? Many I’d think. I should already be fearing for my life ^^


Amnesty International called for a special counsel to investigate “whether administration officials are criminally liable for acts of torture or guilty of war crimes.”

This would please me greatly. I’d love to see the ENTIRE administration brought before an international council and tried for war crimes.

I highly doubt anyone’s going to buy this. If this had happened just after 9/11, Bush would have definately gotten away with it (like he did with the Patriot Act), but with evidence piling against the administration, the shrinking amount of support, and the President’s rapidly falling approval rating, I doubt he’ll get out of this in one piece, even if he’s voted back in.

(Unless they vote along party lines again…facepalms)

The problem with the Patriot Act stimmed a good deal from no one reading it and passing it just as part of Bush’s agenda to safen up " 'merica." If our wonderful representatives other than Feingold had bothered to read the damn thing, they would have realized what they were doing.

Though that would be a good thing to do, i doubt it will happen. They’ve tried to bring the secretaries of other presidents to trial before, but it never happens.

Oh, I know, I don’t expect to see it happen, and even if it did, I wouldn’t expect to see any convictions. Though if it were to happen, it’d set a very nice precedent that political leaders are responsible for their actions.

Nothing good ever came from this town . . .