A news report about a group of missionaries (I guess?) who bring upwards of 300 bibles into the country only to have them confiscated at the airport because it is unlawful to bring “printed religious material into the country if it exceeds the amount for personal use”. By CNN’s wording, it seems as though China even has the flexibility to determine how much printed religious material one needs for personal use.
I especially liked the quote: “Chinese citizens enjoy freedom of religion in accordance with the law.”
As much as Beijing tried to lighten the atmosphere of their city for the 2008 games, it seems that China is intent on staying firm to it’s core principals.
Religion is free untill political power involved in.
Chinese Government is negotiating with Vatican about their “new relationgship” just now. Who knows what behind this political show and what deal they want to make.
I’ll teach them to try and prevent one of the primary psychological weapons colonization used to fuck up the world and bend it to the colonist’s will throughout history! I’ll teach 'em who’s the fucking boss, here!
Seriously, though, if there is any profession history has shown to be less trustworthy (thus discounting the openly hostile) to let into your country than Missionary, I don’t know what it is. Not really that unreasonable or unpredictable, as far as governments go.
What they have done is according to the law, and it’s really normal.
Just like if one person bring one or two PS3, that’s your “personal use”, but if you bring three or more, sometimes they will suspect you want to sell it in China. ( 300 copies of the same book?) That means you’re trying to evade tariff duties, and what you brings will be Confiscated.
This kind of propaganda against China always fool some people. Just like BBC accused China supporting Zimbabwe war, because they found a Dongfeng truck there, but Dongfeng truck is only a kind of cheap truck made in my hometown, this truck is sold everywhere.
They said China is supporting Sudan to control oil, while accually the biggest Sudan’s oil Buyer is Japan.
I am, which was the point of posting. Nothing says religious persecution to me more than the confiscation of religious materials, especially when the reasoning is that you have too much of it.
Don;t forget the one about the airport that confiscated a man’s congressional medal of honor because it looked like it could be a weapon, and none of the security people knew what it was.
I don’t think they’re persecuting a religion, I think they’re trying to stop people from aggressively spreading their religion in a way that has been detrimental, harmful, and even outright violent in the past.
Originally Posted by Arac I don’t think they’re persecuting a religion, I think they’re trying to stop people from aggressively spreading their religion in a way that has been detrimental, harmful, and even outright violent in the past.
Well that, and the fact that by allowing it to be practiced it lessens the absolute authority of the current beliefs in practice. Hell if they let the Christians in next thing you know those Tibetan monks will be demanding to be let back into their own country (not like they aren’t already).
Exactly. They can say that they want to stop the “aggressive spread” of religions because of the reasons you listed, but thats so jaded. Look at the government and the other type of restrictions they enforce (particularly on the internet as well as other things literature that are banned) and its clear that the purpose is not to halt outright violence, but to support that authoritarian iron fist that governs.
That’s what, uh, every government does with every law it has. That’s the idea behind a government. An illusion of intended care and protection is used to cover a truth of intended tyranny and opression. When a government says it is keeping you safe, or helping you, it means it is forcing you into a position of weakness and dependance, so that it might more totally rule over you.
My only comment was that, in comparison to a lot of the other things that government, and most others, have done, this isn’t so ridiculous; the bullshit backing up the power grab is at least somewhat logical.
It is sucky confiscating books, but this is rather low on the list. Blocking internet, controlling the publications system, executions, that falun gong shit (which I don’t know exactly what it is but the Chinese gov says they have 70 million followers and they’re banned) etc. seem more important.
It’s amazing that we are talking about -officially- 1,3 billion people.
According to the official statistics, at present there are 12,000 Chinese Christian Church , Bishop 70, more than 1,200 priests, 16-17 million followers, 12 million copies of Bible will be printed in China every year. ( Maybe the number is wrong because I don’t know the difference between Catholicism and Christianity.)
The difference is in China you you must first swear loyalty to the motherland, over to the Vatican, then you are allowed to be a priest, since religion interfere politics remains a big problem.
There are 13,000 Buddhist temple, over 200,000 monks in China. There are also over 3000 Tibetan Buddhist temple, than 1,700 living Buddhas, monks and nuns 120,000.
The Muslim population in China is 17 million, Muslim temple 40,000.
The religion goverment try to spread is still Confucian, just like in the past 2000 years. They even show it on the Olympic opening ceremony, as you can see.
Still most people in China is antitheist. Antitheism is popular in China for 2000years, too. Everyone accept asking a little good luck, but if a normal Chinese see someone religious(pray or something), he’ll think it’s funny and can’t heip laughing. To me, I’ll try not to laugh, but I still think it’s silly to really belive there is a God or something like that.
OK, you can say this may be a bad culture, they do not respect other people’s beliefs.
This is still a illusion media made. There many crucial problem China need to solve, but none of the what you mentioned is “on the list”. I once hoped other countries can have a helpful impact on China, but this seems impossible now.
Really, if major social problems are solved, China will became even stronger, that’s what US want? US is giving millions of dollars to the “Democratic activists” in China, hoping to change China’s centralism, but if China really change, these “Democratic activists” will lose job. Did they really want to change the country or they just want asking US for money?
Most of the media don’t care about the reality in China, they just kept on saying how bad China is, and how miseriable Chinese’s life are, makingpeople in the other world feel content.
I’ve read that ‘true’ Christianity is practically illegal in China and people worship in other people’s basement secret churches, at risk of being found by the state. My understanding is that the State wants to control the setting and content of people’s worship. The Christianity that China allows to exist is one regulated by the State and not by the Church, which is therefore not the real thing. Care to retort?
My mom was just dragged to the local church by her friends this Sunday.
About those ‘true’ Christianity.
What you should know is that Vatican still don’t recognize the Communist Party goverment as China’s legitimate government as th US do. They recognize the Repubilc of China government who have escaped in Taiwan the legitimate government of China, and still encourage their followers in China mainland to rise up.
What could the government do to those people worship Vatican? Any government with brain will try to stop this meaningless revolt. And of course the media in the West countries with brain will skip the Vatican part of the story to make China look bad.
Nah, usually everyone is responsible for their own problems. The easier way to dispel illusions is being open. Keep in mind though that it’s the Chinese gov that retains capital punishment, they published the numbers about falun gong followers and I doubt Google/Yahoo sent out press releases of “cooperating” with the Chinese gov just to shoot themselves in the foot.
Really, if major social problems are solved, China will became even stronger, that’s what US want? US is giving millions of dollars to the “Democratic activists” in China, hoping to change China’s centralism, but if China really change, these “Democratic activists” will lose job. Did they really want to change the country or they just want asking US for money?
Most of the media don’t care about the reality in China, they just kept on saying how bad China is, and how miseriable Chinese’s life are, makingpeople in the other world feel content.
I haven’t got anything to do with the U.S. But since you’re asking, yes, I’d like a China without social problems, with human rights and with greater communication with the rest of the world. I mean, who wouldn’t like more Chinese poems?
You keep mentioning the Vatican, but the Vatican City controls Catholocism, not Christianity as a whole. For example, I’m methodist and we have absolutlely nothing to do with the Vatican or the Pope or anything.
Theres also a difference between the Vatican and China. As I understand as you have stated, China requires allegience to state over church - but people don’t worship states, so what does that have to do with the church?